Talk:Rainbow Crystals

I used the term 'Seven Great Youma' because it appears in other articles about this group of baddies, but where is that name from?--Sakura 01:25, 28 May 2006 (EST)

Hmm... I've been using the term since it appears in the ADV subs, and it appears to pre-date them, since it's on some older sites. However, that might not be the literal translation... because I've a feeling it's actually something like "Seven Youma". That said, I tend to favour this term because it's fairly universally known, and it's also obvious what it's referring to (as opposed to 'Seven Youma' which sounds a bit non-specific). You raise a good point though. What does anyone else think? Dooky 22:45, 27 May 2006 (MST)

I've edited the page. It needed some grammar edits, some clarifications, some finishing of thoughts (Sailor Moon returns them... to normal) etc. Changed the wikilinks and references for Kamen to Mask also to keep with policy and make the link work. However, I really wish we used Kamen as our standard... most writers seem to be doing so anyway, and literally calling him Tuxedo Mask seems like such a dated dub-ism at this point when we call people by Usagi etc. 72.192.237.134 18:25, 3 June 2006 (MST)Ismail Also... considering we have a page for Crane-Game Joe etc., there should be a Priest page.... 72.192.237.134 18:25, 3 June 2006 (MST)Ismail

The Priest has his own page under his youma name, Boxy. Tuxedo Mask is as appropriate a name as writing Moonlight Knight instead of Tsukikage no NAITO or Pretty Guardian Sailor Moon instead of Bishoujo Senshi Sailor Moon. True we don't translate Usagi to Bunny but Kamen to Mask is hardly a dubism, it's the proper translation of an identity (as opposed to a real name like Usagi).--WikiSysop 21:37, 3 June 2006 (MST)

I generally use 'Kamen' myself, but I don't really think it matters too much either way. The Japanese sources, bothg anime and manga (including ones that pre-date the dub), quite consistently use 'Tuxedo Mask' when rendering the name into English. I know this doesn't necessarily make it any more offical (indeed, I don't think any English spellings used in the Japanese versions should automatically be considered official), it does at least show that the term wasn't solely a dub-invention. It's always a fine line as to what you translate and what you don't... we still have 'Makaiju' instead of 'Evil/Hell/whatever Tree', primarily because the most common translation, 'Doom Tree', is inaccurate, and I couldn't decide which alternative translation to use. There's also the fact that more people probably use 'Makaiju' than Doom Tree or Hell Tree. Popularity of terms is also a big factor here.

Regarding the priest having no page... I kind of agree with Ismail in that he probably should have one. I wasn't really sure to begin with, but we have pages for other un-named characters like the London Youma and... well, Usagi's Fat Friend :P Creating a 'priest' page should be fine as long as you make it clear which priest you're referring to in the opening paragraph. Dooky 22:54, 3 June 2006 (MST)

To be completely clear, I know Boxy's page is informative enough, but then there are two things to consider here. 1) We have pages for the other "untransformed" folks like Crane-Game Joe and Yumemi as WELL as the youma page. So a page for the priest and for Boxy would fit the pattern of the others. Notice how it doesn't even fit the link pattern here if a page like that doesn't exist. Also, a link to Boxy should be there, which to my recollection was not.

As for Kamen/Mask... I know it's the translation, but it seemed to me that the fan circle these days (and on Wikimoon) generally does go ahead and use Kamen out of habit just like they don't call Usagi Bunny... and there is some use of "Serena" but much less than you would expect. It just seemed to me that this wiki is using certain fan-norms where it seemed to me that Kamen was the fan-norm in this case. There's also the fact that at an eyeball's glance it seems MOST contributors after the project has started have used the term Kamen in articles out of habit... which means if we want to be consistent we might want to consider it since both current and future contributors may put it down out of habit.72.192.237.134 18:56, 4 June 2006 (MST)Ismail

Delicious filler

A comment I read in this article brings a question to my mind. Why is the Rainbow Crystal arc so frequently labelled as "anime filler" (a phrase which, like it or not, has certain negative connotations) when other story arcs not in the manga seem to get off more lightly? I'm thinking about the Nephrite/Naru "romance", not to mention Jadeite's numerous energy harvesting schemes being extended from two chapters to about twelve episodes. I know that some people have a downer on anything not in the manga, but there are plenty of these things, so why does the Rainbow Crystal arc get singled out? In my own opinion it contained the season's two best episodes (29 and 31), and it alos turned battles into a bigger deal than just fighting monsters... now the people transformed into monsters had to be saved as well. Am I alone in my fondness for this story arc?

(Oh yeah, this shouldn't be taken as a slight to whoever put the filler comment in there, because like it or not it is a common accusation) Dooky 02:05, 4 June 2006 (MST)

I agree actaully! I understand that they needed to expand the story line for the anime to take more episodes to cover the information and have some action, but I think that the idea of the RAinbow Crystals is pretty interesting. You're right - there are lots of things like it, but perhaps because it is in the first season people most often associate it with filling in time. That's actually why I wrote that comment the way I did. "It is suggested" but that doesn't mean its case-in-point. ^_^ Perhaps we should see to it that other such sections are noted as expanded away from the anime storyline?--Sakky 08:01, 4 June 2006 (MST)

Personally, I'm not fond of any "filler" episodes in any series when they don't contribute to the storyline as a whole, but the Rainbow Crystal arc was a serious deviation from the main storyline and IMHO it was kind of lame to have to "build" the ginzuishou from several other crystals. It just didn't seem to fit with its powers &c as established in the manga storyline. The Naru/Nephrite thing, however, seemed fairly logical and gave added depth to when Nephrite was killed - that was adding character development, not plotfluff. Kerochan no Miko 11:29, 4 June 2006 (MST)

Heheh, looks like we're pretty much diametrically opposed on this one ^_^ I never really liked the Naru/Nephrite thing as it just seemed totally unbelievable to me.... Nephrite's 'conversion' just seemed way too sudden. As for the Rainbow Crystals - sure, they were silly, but the series (manga included) frequently flirts with total absurdity, so it didn't seem too out of place. My real point is that it was a plot device that made for some top-quality episodes (as well as a couple of duff ones, although no more than usual). Ah well, each to their own.

And Sakura: I wouldn't worry about treating all incidents of filler equally. As I said, some people do seem to have a specific downer on this arc (and the Ail and An arc, which I love even more :P) so I don't necessarily have a problem with things as they are. Dooky 13:29, 4 June 2006 (MST)

I loathe the Ail and An arc, as well, so I'm guessing we just go for different things when it comes to story. It's been a really long time since I've watched the Rainbow Crystal arc, though, so I really can't comment on those episodes you pointed out - I'll have to re-watch it some time. Kerochan no Miko 13:34, 4 June 2006 (MST)

I like it aaaallll. Make the anime a thousand episodes even if it requires DBZ-like filler!--WikiSysop 17:20, 4 June 2006 (MST)

I don't think the article tries to single it out or criticize it as being a "filler" time since it wasn't in the manga. It struck me as just trying to note it... and for a substantial story development like this, where the manga and anime differ a lot, it's worth noting what was only in the anime and not in the manga and vice versa. Also, we shouldn't judge story arcs as good or bad ourselves... some of us will hate Ann and Ail, some will love it, and the same is true for this arc and for others. Heck, even the stuff generally agreed on as being "crap" by a large number of people (SuperS to many people) is liked by some just fine. If there are LARGE cases of outside-the-wiki instances of an arc being loved or reviled, we can note that as such but if it's just the writer while another writer feels differently, it's not worh jockeying over.72.192.237.134 18:56, 4 June 2006 (MST)Ismail

Yeah I don't think the article is critical and something like it being considered filler is a fandom note that ought to be there. As long as we keep a neutral ground in the texts themselves then we're good, and that's the case here.--WikiSysop 19:07, 4 June 2006 (MST)

Filler has a negative connotation, true, but there are some anime series that have filler arcs generally acknowledged by their fandom as good (I'm thinking One Piece). A great deal of Sailormoon anime stuff could be considered filler since it deviates from the manga rather drastically, but some of it was rather inspired. Some of it wasn't. Overall, I see "filler" as a neutral word, describing story arcs written as stopgaps. Danny Lilithborne 18:19, 25 July 2006 (MST)

Redirect from Nijizuishou

It's like you read my mind, 210! :) BettyAnn 22:16, 8 August 2007 (MST)